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Snape's lie to Voldemort - (Read before commenting please)

 
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Tessa
Sixth Year
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Joined: Oct 17, 2006
Location: The Netherlands
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PostPosted: July 17, 2007 5:25 am    Post subject: Snape's lie to Voldemort - (Read before commenting please) Reply with quote

My theorie about Snape, DD, Voldemort and the prophecy...

*****

Snape is with Dumbledore because he only gave Voldemort half a prophecy, while he knew the whole thing...

JkRowling @ HBP, UK ed, page 512 wrote:

"Harry," said Dumbledore quietly. "Please listen to me."
It was difficult to stop his relentless pacing as to refrain from shouting. Harry paused, biting his lip, and looked into Dumbledore's lined face.
"Professor Snape made a terrible -"
"Don't tell me it was a mistake, sir, he was listening at the door!"
"Please let me finish." Dumbledore waited until Harry had nodded curtly, then went on. "Professor Snape made a terrible mistake. He was still in Lord Voldemort's employ on the night he heard the first half of Professor Trelawney's prophecy. Naturally, he hastened to tell his master what he had heard, for it concerned his master most deeply. But he did not know - he had no possible way of knowing - which boy Voldemort would hunt from then onwards, or that the parents he would destroy in his murderous quest where the people that Professor Snape knew, that they were your mother and father -"


The only problem with this is that we learned in book 3 that Trelawney can't remember doing (real) predictions, she can't remember anything she says, as well as anything that happens while she does one. If Snape heard the first half, why does she know this, she was in a trance!!

JkRowling @ HBP, UK ed, page 508-509 wrote:

"I wel remember my first interview with Dumbledore," went on Professor Trelawney in throathy tones. "He was deeply impressed, of course, deeply impressed ... I was staying at the Hog's Head, which I do not advise, incidentally - bed bugs, dear boy - but funds were low. Dumbledore did me the courtesy of calling upon me in my own room at the inn. He questioned me ... I must confess that, at first, I thought he seemed ill-disposed towards Divination ... and I remember I was starting to feel a little odd, I had not eaten much that day ... but then ..."
And now Harry was paying attention properly for the first time, for he knew what happened then: Professor Trelawney had maden the prophecy that had altered the course of his whole life, the prophecy about him and Voldemort,
"... but then we were rudely interrupted by Severus Snape!"
"What?"
"Yes, there was a commotion outside the door and it flew open, and there was that rather uncouth barman standing with Snape, who was waffeling about having come the wrong way up the stairs, although I'm afraid that I myself rather thought he had been apprehended eavesdropping on my interview with Dumbledore - you see, he himself was seeking a job at the time, and no doubt hoped to pick up tips! Well, after that, you know, Dumbledore seemed much more disposed to give me a job, and I could not help thinking, Harry, that it was because he appreciated the stark contrast between my own unassuming manners and the quiet talent, compared to the pushing, thrusting young man who was prepared to listen at keyholes - Harry, dear?"


So what did happen?
Trelawney could remember Snape being caught so Snape must have heard the entire prophecy. But Dumbledore told Harry that Snape told Voldemort everything he knew about the prophecy... which was only the first half.
I think Dumbledore lied to Harry, because he knows that Harry is a diseaster in Occlumecy and if he'd tell Harry the truth, there'd be a chance that Voldemort would find out that Snape didn't tell him the entire prophecy.
So Snape must have cooperated with Dumbeldore.

Proof for other things
- This is why Lily and James knew Voldemort was after them (or the Longbottoms), DD told them that he had Snape give 0.5 Prophecy to Voldemort which could get them killed...
- DD LIED! (What else has he lied about?)
- Snape is with the Order
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Azza
First Year
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Joined: Aug 5, 2007
Location: Draco's Personal Torture Chamber
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PostPosted: August 5, 2007 3:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That does make some sense.
I mean how else could Trelawny have remembered Snape if it had not been but after she spoke of the prophecy?

It is also known that Snape is a good occlumens and that would support why Voldermort would not have realised that Snape was lying about having heard the whole prophecy.

About Dumbledore, He pretty much only told Harry really what Harry NEEDED to hear. That could account for his lying perhaps?
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touring3d
First Year

Joined: Jul 23, 2007
Posts: 187

PostPosted: August 16, 2007 2:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

you are reading far too much into those passages.

in DH you see what happens with Snape in "The Prince's Tale"
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Daxxa
Second Year
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Joined: Aug 13, 2007
Location: Canada
Posts: 267

PostPosted: August 17, 2007 6:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

that's an interesting theory. I would have to reread the books to reflect on these parts, especially the sixth and seventh..obviously.

I think trelawny remembers that snape was caught...maybe something like this:

'TRELAWNY IS TALKING IN A FREEKY VOICE BLAH BLAH BLAH I AT THIS POINT HAVE SAID THE FIRST PART OF THE PROPHECY'

snape gets caught...'leave me alone, blah blah' ---misses second part of prophecy

'TRELAWNY FINISHES THE PROPHECY...then back to normal sstate, in time to see the commotion of snape opening the door or something or another..'

it would have to be, there truely is no other explination...read book 7
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DragonTickler
Squib
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Joined: Aug 22, 2007
Location: Hogsmeade
Posts: 58

PostPosted: August 22, 2007 1:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Snape is a smart guy, if he had heard the whole prophecy surely he could have worked out that it was refurring to the Potters and seeing as his love for Lily ment more to him than Voldy did wount he just keep the prophecy secret, as he could guess that Voldy trying to kill Harry would put Lily in danger ?

But he did tell Voldy so Im not sure =/
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GinnyX
Mrs. George Weasley
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Joined: May 6, 2007
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PostPosted: August 22, 2007 11:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

She didn't remember making the prophecy.... read between the lines... literally...

Quote:
I must confess that, at first, I thought he seemed ill-disposed towards Divination ... and I remember I was starting to feel a little odd, I had not eaten much that day ... but then ..."
And now Harry was paying attention properly for the first time, for he knew what happened then: Professor Trelawney had maden the prophecy that had altered the course of his whole life, the prophecy about him and Voldemort,
"... but then we were rudely interrupted by Severus Snape!"


She probably went on a tangent to DD about a bunch of fake prophecies... and then fell into the trance. The next thing she remembers is Snape being there. For all she knows Snape overheard her telling DD that Fawkes will die a terrible death.
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